First Sourdough and big flop
by
luckyissy - posted on: 2008, November 27 - 10:05
Just finish baking my first sourdough bread Pane Francese. Got some nice flavour but flat and chewy more like doughy. I did follow the recipe to the letter and well check for yourself. Please can someone help me figure out what happen. The starter was done following Sourdom recipe (unbleached ap flour and Rye flour) and I
used Bread flour for the dough.
Isabelle
used Bread flour for the dough.Isabelle
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#1
Hi Isabelle, I could ask you a whole bunch of questions and figure it out from your pictures but it'll save time if first give a breif outline of what you did exactly.
Do you still have the starter, yes? good. Keep that going and refresh at least every second/third day until we get to the bottom of the mystery then you can make another batch.
Not so "lucky" Issy......
by Danubian - posted on: 2008, November 28 - 23:52Just finish baking my first sourdough bread Pane Francese. Got some nice flavour but flat and chewy more like doughy. I did follow the recipe to the letter and well check for yourself. Please can someone help me figure out what happen. The starter was done following Sourdom recipe (unbleached ap flour and Rye flour) and I used Bread flour for the dough.
Isabelle
used Bread flour for the dough.Isabelle
Hi Isabelle, I could ask you a whole bunch of questions and figure it out from your pictures but it'll save time if first give a breif outline of what you did exactly.
Do you still have the starter, yes? good. Keep that going and refresh at least every second/third day until we get to the bottom of the mystery then you can make another batch.
#2
I follow the instruction for
by luckyissy - posted on: 2008, November 29 - 02:27
I follow the instruction for pane francese from sourdom but I think I used too much water.
the recipe:
the recipe:
Starter - you need 180g of starter at 80% hydration. This is what I did to
obtain this:
15g starter
30g water
30g bread flour
(stir to paste, leave at room temperature for 12 hours)
Then add 50g water, 100g flour
Mix to a paste, leave for ten minutes.
Pour a teaspoon of olive oil onto a clean board or surface.
Knead the soft dough for ~10 seconds. Return to bowl, cover and leave for 12-24
hours. (This will yield a little more starter than is actually required for the
recipe)
Dough:
180g starter (36%)
350g water (70%)
65g wholemeal flour (13%)
435g white bread flour (87%)
10g (2tsp) salt (2%)
#3
Microflora activity profoundly influenced by temp.
by Danubian - posted on: 2008, November 29 - 23:32
Issy,
If you did in fact double the water in the second stage - 100g instead of 50g - then this still wouldn't account for the result. Yes, it would mean the hydration of the formula was 76.45% which is higher than you aimed, and it would make it a little difficult to handle for a novice. However,I'd recommend a little more mixing during the bread dough stage and perhaps check that your dough temps are not too cold. If your room temp is below 20'C or the sourdough & dough is subject to chilling from opening doors to cold from outside it would show a lack of maltose production & gas production, (which your bread does). Gas retention (which your bread does show a lack of) is affected by final dough mixing and microflora activity.
Finally, how old is your starter? By that I mean how many times have you diluted it with flour and water and allowed it to fermnent?
If you did in fact double the water in the second stage - 100g instead of 50g - then this still wouldn't account for the result. Yes, it would mean the hydration of the formula was 76.45% which is higher than you aimed, and it would make it a little difficult to handle for a novice. However,I'd recommend a little more mixing during the bread dough stage and perhaps check that your dough temps are not too cold. If your room temp is below 20'C or the sourdough & dough is subject to chilling from opening doors to cold from outside it would show a lack of maltose production & gas production, (which your bread does). Gas retention (which your bread does show a lack of) is affected by final dough mixing and microflora activity.
Finally, how old is your starter? By that I mean how many times have you diluted it with flour and water and allowed it to fermnent?
#4
Thank you Danubian for your
by luckyissy - posted on: 2008, November 30 - 00:12
Thank you Danubian for your input.
Yes I am a novice in sourdough bread making but not in yeast baking bread. Reading your last post the room temp was below 20'C.
My starter is 3 weeks old and it's been feeding almost every 24 hours to 36 hours (house being colder at night and it takes longer to get so activities).
Have a question about hydration. where can I get more info on that I don't really understand that part or how you calculate it?
Issy
Yes I am a novice in sourdough bread making but not in yeast baking bread. Reading your last post the room temp was below 20'C.
My starter is 3 weeks old and it's been feeding almost every 24 hours to 36 hours (house being colder at night and it takes longer to get so activities).
Have a question about hydration. where can I get more info on that I don't really understand that part or how you calculate it?
Issy
#6
don't we also need to know what happened with the dough - ferment/prove conditions and times?
don't we also need to know
by davo - posted on: 2008, December 5 - 14:04don't we also need to know what happened with the dough - ferment/prove conditions and times?
#7
Here is the second try
by luckyissy - posted on: 2008, December 6 - 00:38
Well I decided to give it a try again and this time no problem (used the microwave as a proofer).
The problem was that I followed the recipe to the letter instead of waiting for things to happen and that my house is on the colder side (under 18C).
The bread I made was from Makanai website (http://www.makanaibio.com) 1.2.3 bread
measure starter lets say 200g
multiply by 2 the amount of water so 400g (using the weight of the starter)
and multiply by 3 the amount for the flour so 600g.
Mixed all ingredient and folded dough for couple minutes and let it rest for 30 min.
folded dough for 10 minutes and rested for 2 hours (in microwave) with folding dough twice.
folded and let to raise for 4 hours.
It was cooked in a dutch oven for 1 hour with the lid on in a 450F oven
The problem was that I followed the recipe to the letter instead of waiting for things to happen and that my house is on the colder side (under 18C).
The bread I made was from Makanai website (http://www.makanaibio.com) 1.2.3 bread
measure starter lets say 200g
multiply by 2 the amount of water so 400g (using the weight of the starter)
and multiply by 3 the amount for the flour so 600g.
Mixed all ingredient and folded dough for couple minutes and let it rest for 30 min.
folded dough for 10 minutes and rested for 2 hours (in microwave) with folding dough twice.
folded and let to raise for 4 hours.
It was cooked in a dutch oven for 1 hour with the lid on in a 450F oven
#8
I love the way it looks.
by LeadDog - posted on: 2008, December 6 - 04:35
I love the way it looks. Are you going to give a taste report?
The world's best athletes eat raw meat and sleep in the snow naked, sleddogs of course.
#9
Bravo!
by Millciti - posted on: 2008, December 6 - 07:43
I knew you could do it!!! Your second loaf looks wonderful I could just eat it right now!
Terri
Terri
You really are what you eat, so eat wisely...
#10
TeckPoh wrote:Check out the
by LeadDog - posted on: 2008, December 6 - 14:06Just as a test I put my spreadsheet that I use for calculating my dough online. The spreadsheet is fully functional and anyone can use it. The address for the sheet is here http://www.editgrid.com/user/leaddog/Sourdough_2_builds
The first time I tried it I got an error saying it couldn't be found so hopefully it works now. I have some ideas on how to improve the sheet but I'll see how this one works first.
The world's best athletes eat raw meat and sleep in the snow naked, sleddogs of course.